5.0 Replacement

[AMMO_HOOAH]

Well I'm finally getting around to tearing out the engine in the X. This will probably be a long drawn out process (since I'm not really in a hurry), and I know I'll be asking for a lot of opinions on stuff as I come across it. Here's a little background as why it needs the engine yanked. I've FUBARed 4 radiators for one reason or another the first being at 137k miles. It got just a touch too hot trying to limp it home on water from gas stations lol. After the second one I started to get a sticky throttle, and was noticing oil in the intake. Along with some mis codes and egr problems. I've just kind of dealt with it, but back in Nov. I had to drive from Fl. back to Wa., and on the trip I came to discover I was using about a quart of oil per 100 miles. Needless to say this made for a really long trip. Well it's been pretty much stationary since I got up here, and now I have some spare $ to get her back on her feet. Here's some plug pics just to get some thoughts on. I'll be doing the same as I tear it apart and decide if I'll rebuild or buy a long block.

I appreciate any input you guys have.

p.s. I use guys as a non gender orientated reference just fyi.

edit: the plugs have about 10k miles on them since new, and about 5k since I cleaned and reinstalled them.

 

[MustangP51]

Man those are some nasty looking plugs. Are you going to replace the 5.0 or rebuild it? If you have any experience with engines i would say rebuild it. Pull all the guts out of it, have the cylinders honed, or bored .30 over if needed ( that will require new pistons). Then put your money into a decent set of heads.

 

[AMMO_HOOAH]

I'm really on the fence about rebuilding or buying a long block. I'm not really looking at spending a lot on after market heads. I have considered getting a set of TM headers, an electric water pump, and electric fan while I'm at it though (thoughts). Otherwise I can get a remaned long block for $1600 with a 3 year unlimited mileage warranty. I haven't checked to see what having the blocked machined would cost, and I'm worried the heads will both need rebuilt and machined too which I think is going to put me over the $1600 for the whole long block.

 

[ThePhoenix]

thats some crusty plugs...I used to see that in my mustang before I did the valve guide seals

 

[Turdle]

I'm really on the fence about rebuilding or buying a long block. I'm not really looking at spending a lot on after market heads. I have considered getting a set of TM headers, an electric water pump, and electric fan while I'm at it though (thoughts). Otherwise I can get a remaned long block for $1600 with a 3 year unlimited mileage warranty. I haven't checked to see what having the blocked machined would cost, and I'm worried the heads will both need rebuilt and machined too which I think is going to put me over the $1600 for the whole long block.

And then there is your time involved in tearing apart greasy parts-money for cleanup, running for parts, hauling stuff to the machine shop- ect.

I'd do the new engine-

rebuild this one in your own time if you can swing eating the core charge.

 

[chriswells78]

Be careful with those cheap rebuilds, they use crappy parts. They are fine for normal driving but if you get to beating on it at all, they are prone to failure.

If you've got time, you can do it like I did. It took me 6 months to rebuild and replace my engine. I scoured Ebay and picked up unused/slightly used parts from Ebay and forum members much cheaper than buying new. It took me a while to gather everything, but I am extremely pleased with the outcome. I think when it was all said and done, I have about $2300 under the hood. Almost a third of that is in TM headers

My parts list
Roller Rockers $250.00 New on Ebay
Valve Covers $22.00 Used on Ebay
Timing Chain $35.00 New on Ebay
FRPP "e" Cam $135.00 Used on Ebay
Headers $724.00 New from Torque Monster
Lifters $25.00 New from EF member
90mm L-MAF $55.00 Used from Ebay
Water pump $65.00 Used from Ebay (from a test motor)
30# Fuel injectors $118.00 Used from Ebay
75mm Throttle body $122.00 Used from Ebay
Oil pump shaft $8.00 New from Ebay
Lifter guides $38.00 Used from Ebay
FRPP Gasket kit $90 New from Jegs
FRPP Valve springs $65 new from Jegs
Comp Retainers and locks $40 from Jegs
Thrust bearing $8.00 New from Ebay
Valve Seals $8.00 New from Ebay
Pushrods $25.00 New from EF member
Breather Cap $11.00 New from Ebay
Various Fluids and parts $200.00 Napa Auto Parts
Sniper Tuner (half of cost) $180.00 New from PRP Performance
Intake piping $100 from Intakehoses.com

 

[AMMO_HOOAH]

Got it out and the top end torn down. I'll have some pics for you guys tomorrow to take a look at. Everything looked good just a lot of buildup. A couple of the rockers felt loose (bolts tight), and some of the lifters I could depress with about 10lbs of force (calibrated wrist lol).

 

[boominXplorer]

Keep a watch on ebay and craigslist for used motors with low mileage. I picked up an engine with ALL accesories and a tranny with 57k on them for $600. Now depending on how much you are trying to spend you could put new gaskets on it, all new plugs, wires, water pump and still come out for half of a rebuilt long block.

 

[AMMO_HOOAH]

Here's a link to all the tear down pics if anyone is curious: Engine
Here's the top end for you to take a look at:

I don't see/feel any scoring in any of the cylinders, and that liquid in there is cleaner so ignore it. There is definitely a lot of buildup on the pistons and valves though. Let me know what you think. I'll probably tear into the bottom end today, so I'll have some more pics for you. As it looks so far I might only need to be bored and hones, but of course I haven't actually gotten to checking the specs on anything yet.

 

[Turdle]

I think looking at the valve spring caps--there is some carbon buildup from "blowby"
you have bad valve seals-
I'll bet the rings are good!!!! If so, a hone and re ring will fix you up--

 

[MustangP51]

I think looking at the valve spring caps--there is some carbon buildup from "blowby"
you have bad valve seals-
I'll bet the rings are good!!!! If so, a hone and re ring will fix you up--

I agree, Pull the low end apart, and replace the rings, get it honed, and replace the crank and rod bearings while its apart. You can reuse the pistons, use some carb cleaner and steel wool. Just make sure you keep things organized so that each piston goes back in the cylinder it cam out of. Have the heads rebuilt, Valve stem seals, have the valves lapped then put it all back together.

 

[chriswells78]

Wow, you got real lifter guides in your motor stock instead of the goofey nylon ones I had in mine.

Side note: don't you love it how you can't see the coolant down in the holes until you take a picture. LOL

 

[AMMO_HOOAH]

What makes you guys think that it's the valve seals and not the rings? Wouln't they both result in oil in the cylinder like this? And ya I didn't see any coolent then the flash hit it and it lit up like crazy.

 

[boss.hoss]

if you look close at cylinders 1, 5, and 6, you can see the clean ring around the edge of the piston... I've notice that this usually goes hand in hand with wiped out rings... just something I've noticed over the years. The oil coming up over the edge of the rings washes the edges of the piston clean.

 

[AMMO_HOOAH]

Ok got the bottom and heads all torn apart today. I definitely found my number 8 cylinder misfire lol. I went kinda pic crazy so bare with me. Everything looked really good except the timing chain, the #8 piston, and the cam position sensor. The sensor had rust in it, and you can see in the pics what's wrong with the piston and timing chain.

Here's the rest of them:

Thanks for all the input I really appreciate it. How does the crank look to you guys? Looking at all the pistons and cilinders. It looks like I could get away with boring it 10 over, getting new rings, and pistons. As for the heads I still need to pick up a dial indicator and some feeler gauges to see how they spec out. Hopefully everything is well within limits and it's just a matter of getting replacement parts.

 

[boss.hoss]

yeah, the journals all look good, but those are some pretty brassy bearings. if you can get your hands on some micrometers, i would deff. check all the journals, in a few spots each, make sure they are within specs as far as diameter and out-of-round. nice to see no scoring tho, that's always a happy sign.

Make sure you plastiguage everything before it goes back together. I made the mistake of not checking every bearing on mine, after i had the crank ground .010, i made sure they were all the .010 thicker bearings, but didn't plastigauge them and i developed a slight knock about 1500 miles after assy. its alright tho, cuz i've put over 15,000 miles and countless runs down the track on it. run it over 6K daily and it doesn't even care a bit. lol.

 

[CDW6212R]

It looks like the heat affected that piston and those rings. I agree that the bearings look good. I would want a very thorough check done on everything. You can do a rebuild for under $1000 still I believe. That you have some time you mentioned, I would rebuild it. If time was a factor the rebuilt long block would be good, just as a decent used engine would be also.

 

[AMMO_HOOAH]

Ya I've got as much time as I want to do this, so it's not like I'm rushed in this. I'm definitely going to be checking everything out, but it's looking like the block should be pretty inexpensive to take care of. It's the heads that I'm worried are going to be spendy. I'm already going to need a dampener I chipped a piece off and figured it would throw the ballance out of wack. The cam sensor having rust in it is also something I hadn't expected. I hope I can clean it out and not have a problem.

 

[boss.hoss]

i just got done rebuilding an explorer 5.0L engine for my race car, took care of the heads for $100 total. the guides were in good shape, because of the easy life these explorer's usually live. i just ground the seats and valves, replaced the stem seals with ones that came in my gasket set, and bought performance valve springs, retainers, and locks for $100. of course i did my own machining, which is what made it so cheap, i suppose...

 

[AMMO_HOOAH]

Good to know. I found a local shop that's got heads for $269/pr rebuilt, so I don't even think I'm going to bother going through them just get the rebuilt ones. I'm going to take the block, crank, and intakes to them to hot tank and inspect too. Do you guys think I should have them replace the cam bearings while they're at it? Also who has descent replacement lifters for a reasonable price, and what roller rockers can I use?