Completed Project Turboexplorer's Full Width SAS Build Thread

[turboexplorer]

Got back from Moab today and had a great trip over the 3 days we where there. Mine is still down due to the vibration issue but we did take [MENTION=137709]sector9[/MENTION] 's. We ran Poison Spider and Top of the World. Poison spider is always fun and one of my favorites, great night trail. But [MENTION=137709]sector9[/MENTION] 's Newly mounted radius 50" and side pods where fantastic and really really nice. Can't wait to get my radius 50" mounted. And Top of the World is great for some fun and awesome pictures.

We did however manage to split the left front brake line on his Explorer near where poison spider and the golden spike trails meet. So with minimal tools and supplies (found a bunch of things to add to the list of things to pack) We got it pinched off and bleed and drove off the trail and back home. Took awhile without a left front tire that had brakes. Coming down ledges and things took some creative guiding since you could let weight come off the right front of the rig would just slid down in a real hurry. That was Thursday the first day we got there, but found some Russel Brake lines and fitting we where able to make a full legit safe brake line and ran that the rest of the weekend. Still not sure how the brake line made its way over to the coil spring but now we know to make some tethers so it cannot ever happen again regardless of the conditions.

All in all great trip which included a hike to Delicate Arch with the kids and some great times in the swimming pool and condo we had rented. Now for the replacement T-Case to show up this week and get it installed to fix my issue (fingers crossed) O and I found and bought a used 2003 manual shift 4406 with 38K on it for $399 shipped to my door so that's what I will be installing this coming week I hope.

Also while seats and center console are out again I am curious if anyone has replaced their blend door inside the HVAC box from the dash side? I will pull the dash but wanted to make sure I can get to the door to replace it as I only have hot or cold and cannot put it in the middle. The actuator is fine its the physical door that is broken. Anyone done this? (haven't searched it yet)

 

[turboexplorer]

Well I got the used transfer case. Here is to hoping it's the issue. Will be replacing it this weekend. Going to just swap the whole case straight over. Also going to run my trailer brake wires and trailer charging wires while the seats are out.

So fingers crossed

 

[gmanpaint]

Good Luck!

If it helps any... I will cut and sacrifice a section of square tube to appease the Modifying Gods on your behalf. :notworthy

 

[GRNMACHINE]

Im with GMAN good luck!!

 

[turboexplorer]

So I got the transfer case put in and unfortunately it's exactly the same. So not sure where to go from here. Going to do the transmission mount and check if still the same then I may end up just having to drive it until something shows itself. May take up to Tom Woods driveline and see if that have any additional thoughts.

 

[sirhk100]

Jeeze, so can you recap what all you've done at this point to tackle this vibration? Like a bullet list type deal? Seems like you've replaced virtually ever rotating part that exists.

 

[turboexplorer]

So to recap -

Bumped a rock with rear driveline near rear axle pinion. Barely put small dent in tube. Drove home at 65MPH no issues noticed. Thought I'd retube it so as to avoid a driveshaft failure due to a weak spot. (Potentially the dent)

- Retubed original shaft, went to drive to work super bad vibration
- Drove home checked driveshaft found it to be not straight
- Took back and retubed again, still vibration but better than first retube
- Took to a different driveline shop, they heat treated to make straight, rebalanced as well. Still vibrates
- Took out transfer case and went through it. Looked perfect no issues found reinstalled. Still vibrates
- Moved pinion angle from 2.5* to 1.5*. Still vibrates
- Ordered 100% new driveshaft from Tom Woods Drivelines. Still vibrates
- Removed tail housing on transfer case replaced bushing. Still vibrates
- Replaced rear gears with 100% new set, new bearings and new pinion flange. Still vibrates
- Replaced transfer case with a complete used unit (supposed to be 38K). Still vibrates
- Me totally lost and confused and $1,500 dollars into chasing the issue

To add - Vibrates on jack stands in full dress, no tires, no tires and brakes, no tires brakes or axles.

Cannot find anywhere anything is rubbing etc. And no noise transfer or concern at any speed below 50MPH. Vibration starts roughly 55MPH and has been dead consistent through driveline changes and gear swap and transfer case replacement. Have front driveline removed hubs checked etc etc nothing up front is turning. And definitely vibrates from the rear.

Also does in in any gear in transmission and stays dead consistent not change in vibration between 3rd or 4th gear. Also doesn't change between on throttle, off throttle etc. Not RPM related at all.

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[gmanpaint]

You mentioned checking the trans mount, so if that turns out fine....

Cracked trans cross member or frame at cross member mounts?

Cracked/broken leaf mounts/bushings, or frame areas/tabs around bushing bolts.

Just trying to think outside the box with those areas.

 

[mounty71]

Tires balanced? Bent wheel? Not sure how fixing the original problem of a dented driveshaft correlates with either of those possibilities, but just trying to think of anything that would cause a vibration.

I noticed after my latest off road trip that I have an occasional slight shimmy in the rear and I've noticed what looks like some oil spots in the rear wheel well, so I'm suspecting a bearing and seal issue. Have you checked your bearings?

 

[turboexplorer]

You mentioned checking the trans mount, so if that turns out fine....

Cracked trans cross member or frame at cross member mounts?

Cracked/broken leaf mounts/bushings, or frame areas/tabs around bushing bolts.

Just trying to think outside the box with those areas.

I will check the cross member when I do the mount this weekend.
Leaf mounts looked fine on a previous inspection and leafs are new and have all new bushings.
I'll do a full inspection on all rear suspension components this weekend. Then we can recheck all them off the list.

Tires balanced? Bent wheel? Not sure how fixing the original problem of a dented driveshaft correlates with either of those possibilities, but just trying to think of anything that would cause a vibration.

I noticed after my latest off road trip that I have an occasional slight shimmy in the rear and I've noticed what looks like some oil spots in the rear wheel well, so I'm suspecting a bearing and seal issue. Have you checked your bearings?

Tires where balanced recently, (recently being relitive since its been since Febuary but ony have 40 miles since then) they did a dynamic balance instead of static last time not sure why but may be tempted to pull all wheel weights on the rears and retest drive and see if any differenece. But don't think it's it since the vibration is VERY fast and is much faster than wheel speed but will go through it all regardless.
The one wheel is slightly off center but has been since new so not sure why that would change now. Axle bearings have only 7K on them and no leaks, and the new rear shafts only have 1K on them. I inspected them all when I regeared the diff and found no issues.

 

[adamsbro2]

It may sound silly but have you washed the truck? I have seen mud get packed into wheels in weird places and cause all sorts of havoc. Like above just saying what I know has caused vibrations before...you might try rotating the wheels and see if the vibration moves. Grasping at straws for ya but worth asking.

 

[Marky_Mark]

Have you done anything to eliminate the Detroit locker in the rear. If it does vibrate with tires or brakes taken off then those are eliminated. I know you put new gears and bearings so that shouldn't be it, if its the same locker that you put in with those gears it might be worth looking into whether or not its causing the vibration. If you have another carrier try putting that in and seeing what happens.

 

[sirhk100]

Man, your issue keeps popping in my head on occasion and I seriously can't believe after all of that it's still not resolved. Do you have a dial indicator? Can you lift the rear and run a dial along a round portion of the pinion as you spin a wheel by hand to make sure it's still spinning true?


Oh and btw, I picked up 4 of these this morning finally!!!

We did Vegas to Reno this weekend with the race truck and it came home pretty beat down. I've got 8 weeks to turn it around for our next race and these stands should help a ton being able to work bumper to bumper at once rather then one end at a time like I've always had to tackle it before...

 

[turboexplorer]

It may sound silly but have you washed the truck?

Yes it's been washed and I've had all the wheels off and washed inside of rims as well. No luck.

Have you done anything to eliminate the Detroit locker in the rear.

I ran it without the ring gear or locker in it. And no change still vibrated, even with just pinion, drive shaft and T-Case.

Man, your issue keeps popping in my head on occasion and I seriously can't believe after all of that it's still not resolved. Do you have a dial indicator? Can you lift the rear and run a dial along a round portion of the pinion as you spin a wheel by hand to make sure it's still spinning true?


Oh and btw, I picked up 4 of these this morning finally!!!

We did Vegas to Reno this weekend with the race truck and it came home pretty beat down. I've got 8 weeks to turn it around for our next race and these stands should help a ton being able to work bumper to bumper at once rather then one end at a time like I've always had to tackle it before...

Yes I have good dial indicators and everything ran true before I even did the rear gears but thought hey its the only thing left. No luck though. Haven't done it since new gears and pinion flange though. But vibration didn't change at all so doubt it has an issue. But can check again.

Didn't get around to throwing the trans mount in last weekend but I did look at its current one closer and looks good. Can't see any rubbing issues or excessive movement. But will throw it in to be sure. Will be at the Grand Prix at Miller Motor sports Park thus Saturday but will find time to get it in. At least this time I left the seat and center console and skid plate front drive shafts etc out until I get it fixed. Lol, decided it to much work to pull everything everytime.

You'll love the stands. Makes things much easier. Sorry about the race truck but it still kept everyone safe so it did it's job. Sometimes fun to rebuild and refresh.

 

[sirhk100]

Engine is already ready to pull out of the truck, gotta yank the shocks tonight to gain the tiny bit of clearance and then lift it out. Transmission will probably be out of it tonight also and then this weekend it goes up on those stands and stripped down to bare chassis for inspection and prep. Hoping to have the suspension 100% prepped and back on it next week along with a few chassis improvements. Maybe beef up the steering rack mounts the following week and the drivetrain back in after that. It's a lot of work but it'll go fast...

The new stands have turned it into a hover truck!!!! The jackstand in the back is only holding the axle housing in place. Love the stands!!!!

 

[turboexplorer]

So still have the issue. Reset the rear gears again just to double check. No luck. May end up going back to a normal driveline so the rotating weight is reduced. Current driveline is 27lbs.

So still working on it. Need it running by winter want to get it buried in some deep snow. Want to use the winch!

Looks sad, hasn't gone 100miles since February.

 

[gmanpaint]

Man, what a bummer.

If the stock driveline doesn't remove the vibrations, the only other thing I can think of is your transmission having a pulsing pressure issue. Something might be blocked, or failed in the fluid path. It could just be a complete coincidence it happened at the same time you bent the driveshaft.

 

[turboexplorer]

True, hoping that isn't it seeing as how I could have had a new trans for what I have put into chasing the issue though.

A great picture to pass the time........................................................

 

[turboexplorer]

Well no good news to report but I have taken it out. And even pulled a trailer with it. Was only 75miles round trip but was farther than it has been since February. Did great no issues at all as long as you keep it 55mph or under.

Did a few full throttle pulls with the trailer to get in some exercise. Sadly the point was to try and find anything new with the added weight of gear and full family and tongue weight of the trailer as well as the effort it takes to pull it etc etc. But nothing new to report in 75 miles going up a narrow winding canyon to back down with trans geared down etc still didn't find anything new or new thoughts on what the issue could be.


But here is some pictures from that weekend.

 

[ford99_1979]

Besides the vibration issues. Your truck is really sharp looking for 17yr old vehicle. Better looking than most current vehicles.