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Turbo on 2000 Limited 5.0

Turbo compressor map.gif
Well guys, I don't even have it yet and I'm looking at going turbo.

I think I'll be going STS style with the turbo underneath the the body. I'm hoping I can find room somewhere closer to the front to mount it. If not, I may just go classic style and cut the muffler out and install the turbo in its place.

Tim was kind enough to point me at a turbo for sale locally. I'm checking it out now. I sent the specs to James Henson to see what his thoughts are.

Here's the specs:
t4 F1-68 turbine .68 a/r housing 3" exhaust outlet with a 72mm compressor blade 4inch inlet, 2.5 inch outlet, journal bearing. Also, see compressor map attached. I have a vague understanding, and that concerns me.

Now, the next issue is oil routing.
Oil in to the turbo would be handled from a T off the oil pressure sending unit on the block. Return oil would need a scavenge pump to the top of the oil pan, or in the timing chain cover. The scavenge pump adds quite a bit of cost to the setup. I think saving a few bucks in this area would spell disaster. So, this seems to be the best pump out there:
http://turbowerx.com/Scavenge_Pumps/Exa-Pump/Exa-Pump.html
Stainless steel oil lines will have to be used. As I read about under cab mounted turbo's oil issues seem to be a huge issue. This is going to require careful thought and routing.

My real issue is routing the air filter and compressed air up to the engine bay.
The frame rails will be the the way. I saw one guy notched out his frame for the plumbing and re-enforced the frame by welding metal around the plumbing line (3 inch or 4 inch hole). I'm concerned about running the two pipes and think this will be the biggest challenge. I really don't want that air filter under the truck.
See what this guy did on his ranger?

As for Maf? Pro-M all the way, in a blow thru design.

Fuel pump, injectors, sct go without saying. I'll be having James put together a care package for me along with the Pro-M.
Aeromotive Stealth 340 pump
Bosch uscar (EV6) 60lb injectors part # 108191

I'll recycle my boost gauge and wide band o2 from my supercharged 4.0 ohv.

I'll be using stainless steel for everything under the truck as rust always seems to be an issue.

Also. intercooling. I learned from my last project that cool intake air is incredibly important. People say on under cabin turbo's you don't really need it as the compressed air cools on the way up. Not good enough for me. Im going to go air/water so I have flexibility as to where I mount the intercooler. This could change, but intercooling of some form is a must.

My eye's are watering at what this is going to cost.

I see 02Limited turbo'd his, but he must have had quite a few issues and fell off the forum.

Not much info on guys completing something like this to be found. All input appreciated.

This will be a long process.
 


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CDW6212R

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Okay, the Explorer 302 WP is 4.25" long to the shaft end. But from the back, to the pulley mounting surface, is only 3 3/8" distance.
 


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Dono

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CDW6212R

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I'm just not going to take the chance of creating more issues for myself. I wasn't having over heating issues before, so I'm just going to move to a high flow thermostat https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/mrg-4364/overview/ and use the standard volume Ford pump.

I think that's the same 180* T'stat I just installed in my truck, with a new radiator and fan/clutch set. I'm seeing about 175* every day most of the time, on my Scan Gauge I've hooked up recently. The highs seem to hit 180-190* each day, that's about 4-5 hours of drive time in 56 miles, typically we're 75-90* during my route. I run the AC after it's been in the mid 80's a while, usually about an hour at the end of my route. That doesn't affect the coolant temps at all.
 




Centaurus5.0

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Looks like you guy figured it out.. The SN95 is a reverse same as the explorer but about 3/4" longer. Dons right about the pulley being the issue.. but there are way around that a well.. but may be too much trouble. As long as the stock pump is working for you, why give yourself more headaches they you already have. I do think its doable to use a sn95 pump with offset fans and the right pulley.. if needed.

And there is of coarse other things that can be done like a cooler thermo like you mentioned or installing a big air-to-oil cooler or vents in the hood or fenders, pusher (along with a puller) fan, thermal coatings.. but, I do think we sometimes shoot ourselves in the foot by over-engineering solutions to problems we don't have.. which I have been guilty of in the past. But I do like to conceive every possible option and senerio and find every part available and brainstorm what is possible and what is not before coming up with a final (and most simple and least expensive and least bs) conclusion.. as ya'll do.:)

What we really need to do as enthusiast is band together and start petitioning companies to make the parts we want and need. A well written letter and a couple hundred signatures telling Stewart to start making a pump for us Explorer/ 5.0L swap guys or to custom header makers for 1 5/8" shorty headers and they will take notice. Of coarse all of us here know how that always works out.. 99.9% sit back and don't say anything and hope something will happen without effort on there part..


But anywho.. as you were gentlemen

:popcorn:
 




Dono

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The enthusiast thing didn't work so well on the Torque Monster group buy thru Al's headers. Its to bad that worked out the way it did.
It's tough with our 20 year old trucks to get any manufacturer to even blink in our direction.

Just how many people are crazy enough to modify the crap out of an old explorer to make it go fast? Probably not the same market as mustangs, that's for sure.
 




Centaurus5.0

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I would have to say, there are many more 5.0L explorers still on the road than 94-95 5.0 Mustangs. And take Al's headers as an example, how many "race" headers do they actually sell in a week for 60+ year old VW bugs?

Used explorer motors are the go-to budget sbf to use for anything because really, that is all that is left to use in the junk yards while having the best sbf factory heads, intake, accessories, etc.. just look at how many things people put them in! Bronco's, Rangers, Rock Crawlers, Buggies, Racer Cars, F150's, Many different Kit Cars and Resto-Mods, Mustangs, Miatas, Boats... They have the shortest accessory drive and if you could make some headers, they would have the tightest fit headers which would replace other vehicle specific headers that are already out for sbf, design some universal fit with extension adapters to fit different collector positions. If they are still making parts for flatheads, I don't think the explorer 5.0L's will be disappearing anytime soon.

But like we all found out here, just finding a halfway descent pump is hard to find at any price and for $15 more that a China made Motorcraft you could buy a superior made American pump that cools better and last longer, if they just made one for our rigs.

I dunno. I just can't get me no satisfaction with the aftermarket automotive companies these days..
 




Centaurus5.0

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Is there something like the GoFundMe site but where people submit request for aftermarket part and people vote for them and then vendors pledge to produce a part when it gets so many likes or hits or views?
 




gmanpaint

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Aftermarket support is lobbied by big name vehicle manufacturers, for certain models. Deals are struck, before they ever get into production stage. Cornering a market is a strategic maneuver and plays a part in the vehicles production projections. Non compete clauses are part of these deals. These deals are made with large parts manufacturers, and we are left with the small companies to make special, unpopular products. The prices are high, as they can't compete or produce for the same costs. Not many are willing to stick a neck out, for fear of going in the red, and that's not why they are in bizz to begin with . This leaves the enthusiasts to make the small number of odd parts we desire. The die hard, figures a way to fabricate, modify, or beg. The band Wagoner, folds, jumps ship, and joins the masses with the plentiful cheap after market suppprt.
 




vroomzoomboom

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Just how many people are crazy enough to modify the crap out of an old explorer to make it go fast? Probably not the same market as mustangs, that's for sure.

what kind of idiots would do a stupid thing like that?
 




4pointslow

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I wrote to Meziere about having an electric water pump made for the 4.0 SOHC.
Figured "why not?" since I had custom pulleys made by ASP racing (thanks to JD for the tip) and a custom intercooler by Bell intercoolers I was having good luck having custom stuff made.
They replied which I though was great. They stated that to start the engineering process it would be 2,000. And then it would go up from there until completed
They also stated I could just use an inline pump(from them) and install it in the radiator hose and cut the stock water pump impellor off.
 




Dono

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That's actually a great idea for us v8 guys with limited space up front also. We could trim the front of the water pump down also to get some more clearance.
Yea, we are paying to play, that's for sure. On the electric water pump I'm just not sold on them with a daily driver. 8 more amps being drawn at idle with AC, fan on full, headlights, etc. Complexity, risk when its well below freezing......Just scary.
 




CDW6212R

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Ditto, my electric cooling fan in my 99 works great, but when the circuit breaker failed, the engine hit 270* before I caught it. No harm was done, except the failed open T'Stat. But the reliability is really important, it has to be done properly.
 




Centaurus5.0

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But the reliability is really important, it has to be done properly.

Reliability is absolute.

Even though they are on millions of cars, I can't take the risk of one failing when I'm driving across the country by myself towing at or near max load though mountains and deserts or going through deep water if I find myself in severe weather or creek crossing. Fuel pumps, water pumps and electric issues (electric fan) I find are the 3 biggest gotchas. A blown water pump almost ruined a trip for me once already. Stock fuel pumps go 20 years/ 150k plus miles reliably and should only need to be changed once (maybe twice) in the lifetime of rig. Everything else either gives warning signs (noise or feel), can be "fixed" on the side of the road or nursed along until you get to a shop or parts store. A fuel pump will just leave you stranded but a blown out water pump or in-op cooling fan can blow an engine. A lot of heat can accumulate under a hood without some kind constant air circulation and will effect everything rubber, plastic and electrical. (For example: coil pack life if effected by heat.) Same thing with overheating a transmission, The metal parts don't have a problem with 300 degrees, it's the seals and fluid that do. I take my mech fan off completely from Nov-Mar when temps are -0 to 50 and I don't go out of town so it's not a problem in the least. But high HP(heat) or 80+ high temps and/or stagnate air can roast an engine if cooling is not in constant check. If you had a blower/turbo under the hood and headers with long tubes filling up all the extra space in the engine bay, things can get bad even quicker, I would imagine.

I would love to have an electric fan if for any other reason not to hear fan woosh and free up a dozen or so hp when spinning it, but rock solid reliable cooling is too important for me to ditch the mechanical fan. Not to mention the added draw on the electrical system puts more strain on the alternator and battery which in turn lesses there life from the heat when the fan is not moving, and increased risk of electrical gremlins manifesting themselves with every extra wire and connection.

An observation: You only see electric fans on cars. Heavy vehicles (pick-ups/suv's) that are designed to haul loads have mech fans or mech fans with an electric cut off with a fail-safe. To move weight takes power, and to move more weight (or move weight faster) means more power means more heat means cooling is more critical. Look at how much surface area the front (grill) these new pickup trucks have now. Our 2nd gens are limited in this area.

Hood vents anyone?
18639.jpg
 




gmanpaint

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I think all of our heavily modified vehicles will never see the use, they once did in stock form. The 95 ex gets worked on more than used, and has logged around 10k miles in the last 10 years. It has beefed up parts, that make stock parts, look like toy parts. These parts will be abused harder than stock parts, and can (& will) succumb to failure, just like stock parts do, but...As I always say, it's better to overbuild, than under-build.

Now lightly modified vehicles is a different story. If your hopping up your stocker, just to make it a bit faster, handle better, and just more enjoyable to operate, that's when these systems/parts are really put to the test for longevity & reliability. I also think that some items are best left alone in stock configuration, just for that reason.

So, if a stock part can last for 100k miles, and the vehicle is already 20 years old, and the chances of it going another 100k miles are slim, why not just use a new stock part? This is where the cheap overseas replacement parts kick our ass, and this line of reasoning. So what do we do now? Blind faith,with trial and error, is the only answer I can think of.

One of us should start a trusted parts forum, that people can submit what products they used, and reviews of success or failures. Can have a OME & an aftermarket section. Just an idea here, but it seems too many of us keep spending hard earned cash, only to find it failed, or is sub-par to expectations/hype.

I think I will keep my 5.0 as close to stock as possible, and only do very mild upgrades. When the time comes, I hope to get as much help/input as the rest of you have gave on this site. :D
 




Centaurus5.0

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One of us should start a trusted parts forum, that people can submit what products they used, and reviews of success or failures. Can have a OME & an aftermarket section. Just an idea here, but it seems too many of us keep spending hard earned cash, only to find it failed, or is sub-par to expectations/hype

GREAT IDEA GMAN! and right on point with your observations about aftermarket and oem part.

EF lost much when it lost the old product reviews section. As always is the case, having a format that is easy to navigate and able to see everything at a glance is key. One thread with 80 pages isn't efficient, and neither is a separate thread for each part or a sticky most people will over look. I like the old Internet with just one main page with pics and links and info all in one place that take you to other pages with more detailed pics and links and info.. like the old EF page and tccoa.com.

I for one have plenty of pics and opinions to share when it come to parts..

@Rick @turtle :wave:
 




Turdle

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Making an Explorer ( Mounty) go fast. Meh, it would have been easier to try to save my first marriage.
 




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