V8 Engine Swap

[wood1]

Does it stop pinging if you put a high octane gas in it?

 

[ric232]

Sure, but why should I have to? Besides, if I do that, the EGR will crud up and it will eventually start pinging on 93 octane anyway. I have a friend with the exact same vehicle in that very predicament.

 

[Dan Whitaker]

Funny. We have real winters here in Kansas City and I have never had a problem.

Why do you think your EGR will "crud up" using higher octane gas. I have 207,000 miles on my original EGR and have never had to clean it.

 

[ric232]

Funny. We have real winters here in Kansas City and I have never had a problem.

Why do you think your EGR will "crud up" using higher octane gas. I have 207,000 miles on my original EGR and have never had to clean it.

Yep. It's more affected by the time of year than the temperature so I think it has to do with the change in gasoline formulation for the "winter" period.

Burning higher octane fuel in a low-compression engine releases more pollutants and unburned fuel into the exhaust (and thus into the EGR).

 

[wood1]

I searched 5.0 pinging and found that you have been trying to fix this for a long time, that must be very annoying. I'll stop bugging you, I'm sure you've tried just about everything...

 

[ric232]

I searched 5.0 pinging and found that you have been trying to fix this for a long time, that must be very annoying. I'll stop bugging you, I'm sure you've tried just about everything...

I have been, but you're not bugging me. I appreciate the effort. But I've given up on "fixing" it and have decided to either replace the engine or perhaps mod the heck out of it to where the old "demons" will go away. Seems like the cylinder heads might be a good place to start. Are there any aftermarket aluminum heads that will work in place of the GT40P's ?

 

[JDraper]

How about trying a custom tune instead of tossing a boatload of cash at it? A good tuner can dial in your motor so it won't ping and still have good performance.

 

[wood1]

^^^My thoughts exactly.

There are many heads available for the 5.0, I ported my E7 heads in my stang, that distrubutorless ignition is a bit more complex than the old system. Even with many improvements most guys easily run 15 or 16 degrees of timing in their stangs, they come factory at 9...

You could pull your spout connector...band-aid fix mind you.

The GT40P heads are suppose to be a nice head...

You plug wires aren't shorting on each other? I suppose the coilpacks fire multiple sparks each stroke... I wonder if some hotter coils would help?

 

[Four0Sport]

i had a smiliar problem, and it only occurred when it was cold.. for a while. then it turned into an every day all year long thing. i know you said you dont have an exhaust leak, but check the bellows on your egr tube. i had my vehicle checked for a leak by using one of those backpressure things and no one could find it, i even almost spent a trillion dollars i didnt have for TorqueMonster headers, luckily i wiggled my egr tube one day and it came apart in 7 pieces. $50 at Ford garage for a new stainless egr tube w/out bellows and its been fine ever since. no pinging, rattling, ticking.. its a nice feeling.

oh, aftermarket coils helped deter the detonation i as experiencing under load on the interstate. just thought id throw that in there after wood's mentioning of it. and now i have fancy MSD stickers on my rear qtr window.

 

[CDW6212R]

I'd agree with most suggestions her, but the tuning was my first thought. A real PCM tune should include data logging, that could identify whether the issue is related to timing, plugs, wires, fuel pressure, or a few other things. It would be easier to diagnose if you had that testing done to begin with.

I and most here have not had pinging at virtually any time. I have been very impressed with that aspect of my 98 302, different from past non OBDII engines.

The GT40P heads are very good for stock, changing them would require the non P headers to use them, which has a different EGR system. It would be best if you stayed with the P heads, even swapping them with other cleaned up or ported versions.

So you could spend a few hundred on head work, or several hundred on tuning, one or the other should take care of the issue if nothing else is out of whack. Good luck,

 

[ric232]

I and most here have not had pinging at virtually any time.

I am shocked to hear that considering many of the owners in the "stock" forum have this issue (assuming they use regular unleaded fuel) and nobody seems to be able to solve it once and for all. It seems to be a given for this motor.

[EDIT] Don, I just noticed you had a similar problem back on Oct 2005. (See link to thread below.) What fixed it for you?

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144867

 

[Turdle]

Did you chaeck you crank pulley for alignment-
just saying "it shouldn't be" isn't going to fix anything. Your engine is pinging. Something is in a "shouldn't be" condition. You aren't going to find it by saying things"shouldn't be" wrong at 10k.

The crank pulley is a one peice design, but it is made up of 3 parts-
2 of which are "vucanized" or wedged together with a rubber shim. That rubber vulcanized joint can, and will slip. If it does, your ignition timing will advance--

It may look good using timing light-however the crankshaft relationship has changed.
The area thet slips is between the crank trigger and keyway area-
The crank trigger will trigger the spark at the correct time--but the crankshaft is "out of synch"

 

[CDW6212R]

Most of the problems will be here, searching for an answer. The vast majority don't have pinging and don't post that here. My older Mark VII's and Mustangs were prone to pinging in hot weather, and light loads. These newer OBDII PCM's(1995+) are better at controlling the timing to avoid most pinging. My truck had 98k on it when I bought it, and I never heard any until about the 150k mark. It has been very very mild/minor since then, but I attribute that to age and less maintenance. I'm working towards a new 332 soon.

Do think about a better tune and/or some other new parts. As an example, toss your spark plug wires, most likely they need changing, don't buy cheap wires, do either Ford, Magnecor, or Taylor. Regards,

 

[ric232]

Did you chaeck you crank pulley for alignment-
j

Jon,

Is it possible to explain to me how to check this? I'm happy to do it if I know how.

 

[ric232]

Do think about a better tune and/or some other new parts. As an example, toss your spark plug wires, most likely they need changing, don't buy cheap wires, do either Ford, Magnecor, or Taylor. Regards,

I have Ford wires with 46k miles on them. I replaced them at 50k because 5 of them went bad. It made no difference in the pinging. I have new Ford spark plugs. A year ago I put in new Ford O2 sensors and a Ford fuel filter. Cleaned my MAF and IAC again yesterday. I'm fairly well convinced that this is an issue with EGR flow. I replaced the EGR about 3 yrs ago. The pinging went away for a brief period but it gradually came back within the first year. I may do it again to see if the problem goes away. EGR's are cheap. I supposed I could replace it every year.

 

[CDW6212R]

No, skip the same EGR part, another part could have an affect, but not the same replaced part. On a side note, you do use the throttle every once in a while yes? All engines need to see WOT once in a while, it is beneficial.

That's good about the tuneup items, they need the normal replacement. I'd have the fuel pressure checked, as well as the MAF sensor signal. That's the kind of thing that should be done prior and during PCM tuning. The programmer verifies that the sensors and inputs are correct before making tuning changes. You can do tuning by a guess of a tuner, some are satisfied with that(like a chip). You have a driveability issue so you would require hands on tuning, either a dyno or data logging for the tuner to analyze.

It sounds like you have done most of what you can do before the serious tuner route.

 

[Turdle]

Jon,

Is it possible to explain to me how to check this? I'm happy to do it if I know how.

You'll need to pull it off. You are going to hat me for this--but I cannot stand to fight the fanblade-remove it and the shroud. you'll find the crank pulley and belt are much easier to work on this way.

Once you get it off,if you look real closely, there should be a white dot-on the backside-
the keyway should line up exactly with it. If there is a slight shift you have found your problem. If you can get it off and get a picture I'll gladly look at it.
Also-look the kaeyway over for a bent or gouged appearance. If the misalignment is noticable-this would be about 5-10 dgrees too much timing. That'll make it ping.

Just don't hit me if it chacks out normal.

send me pm for my email address--

 

[ric232]

Ok, I'll bite.

1. So is removing the fan as simple as removing the four bolts? Will the fan slide out from there? I think I can get to the crank pulley from the bottom w/o removing the fan shroud (unless it needs to be removed to get the fan out).

2. I don't know how to loosen the belt to remove it. I used to know how on my last two Mustang 5.0's (1989 and 1994) but this doesn't look the same and it's harder to get to the tensioner.

3. I'm assuming I'm just removing the pulley and not the harmonic balancer, correct? And all I need is a socket wrench to remove the pulley, right?

Thanks.

 

[CDW6212R]

The pulley is part of the balancer(one piece). The fan clutch removal requires a special large wrench, you rent it from a part store.

You can see the balancer from some angles, for inspection I would look at it, and tap the starter if needed. I'll look at one of my spare balancers to see what that marking would look like. I recall the trigger wheel being lined up with the key way, that's what matters. Jon evidently noticed a mark on the outer surface which would correspond with that alignment.