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Dreamr's 5.0 top end build up

dreamr

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Hmm I kinda ignored this project til Staurday, but here is Saturdays update...

DAY 4-5

Removed timing indicator and Smog bracket

Removed battery cable & tranny line bracket

Removed passenger side wire bracket

Began the long arduos task of degreasing all the lines, brackets, block, wires, and etc in the front half of the motor.

re-wrapped wiring harnesses and replaced some witing

primered and began painting the front of the block

Removed header

Removed chassis X Brace for painting

Removed hard heater lines from lower intake

Removed fuel system wiring harnesses

Soo much cleaning!!!!

Painted all front dress bracketry

Finished polishing last valve cover, IAC, tensioner arm, power steering shroud, and water neck

Greasy block and ....well everything
greasyblock.JPG


The front end looking a bit cleaner
dayend.JPG


And of course all the newly painted bracketry and polished items.....I still have more to do, but we'll get to that later.

100_1589.JPG



Now for my questions... Some of which are pretty newbie like:D

Radiator......How to I get it really clean inside?

Harmonic balancer........ Do i need to take this off to remove the timing cover? How?

TDC........The Head instructions tell me to set the engine at cylinder #1 TDC on the compression stroke.....How? and How to tell where it is at?
 


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JDraper

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Radiator......How to I get it really clean inside?
Take it to a radiator shop and have it cooked. Only good way.

Harmonic balancer........ Do i need to take this off to remove the timing cover? How?
Yes. You need to have a harmonic balancer puller. You can buy one fairly cheaply from most auto stores.

TDC........The Head instructions tell me to set the engine at cylinder #1 TDC on the compression stroke.....How? and How to tell where it is at?

That is when the #1 piston is at the top of its stroke with both the #1 intake and #1 exhaust valves shut. The #1 piston will be at TDC twice. Once on compression, and once on exhaust. On compression, no valves are open. On exhaust, the exhaust valve will be open.

See post #11 in this thread...when the dots are aligned as rookieshooter said, you should be at TDC on compression.
 








dreamr

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Ouch

I took my radiator into NW radiators today to see if they couldn't clean it out. The guy popped the cap, looked in there, and laughed.

He says I may be able to clean that out, but it'll cost a bit.......Seems it was nasty enough that he wanted to cut it open and "rod" it after baking.......
Cost 120 bucks.......

Then he says or if you want to spend 25 dollars more I have a brand new 3-core OEM replacement for your car in the back........Needless to say I have a new radiator and no money :(
 




dreamr

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Day 5 or 6 or something.....

Again not a whole lot got accomplished, but in truth what I am really doing is a hell ot of cleaning and detailing and painting. But you'll see all that when I actually start getting the engine back together. Though I suppose you can see the freshly painted block and K-Member in the last photo....

So what has got done?

- Disconnected fuel system

- Removed the smog thermactor crossover pipe from the rear of the heads

- Removed crank pulley

- Removed harmonic balancer

- Removed timing cover

- Removed lower intake

Like I said not a lot, but then again I only have a couple hours in the evenings of free time so...........it's slow.

That damn crank pulley was the worst thing to get off with all the lock tite I used when I installed the underdrive units :fire: Then as I asked above how do i get the dampner off........well it would have helped if I would have noticed that not only was there a bolt in there that I had removed but also a washer :eek: . No wonder my bolt puller wasn't working before I posted up on here...

All in all though it is getting close to stripped down.

Below are a few pictures, but I have questions for the 1st one. You can see the timing gears and chain here. The dots on the sprockets were hard to see in the photo so I highlighted them in ms paint. So is this TDC? I realize this was all explained to me in post #11 and again just above.....but. A ford engine goes (see below) correct? I know look in my book, but I can't find it right now. I was looking at #5 as noted below thinking #1 so it may be accurate, but of course I want confirmation before I pull the dizzy an heads.
4 8
3 7
2 6
1 5

Picture #2 shows a very very nasty coolant passage in my driver side head,
and of course #3 is the day end photo.

TDC_Question.JPG


nasty_coolant_passage.JPG


day_end.JPG
 




410Fortune

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man that looks familiar :)
 




dreamr

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man that looks familiar :)

I am sure, you have done a few of these lately....

So 410 can you confirm that the engine is indeed at #1 TDC compression

You can see the timing set marks above....it apperas that both valves are closed on the 1st cylinder on the passenger side (i believe #1) and the distributor rotor is pointing to where the wire would plug in to go to the cylinder mentioned above (passenger side front)

Sorry I am such a fool in some areas....but ya know I got learn somehow;)
 




410Fortune

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No I am not the person to ask about this!!!
I have only done this once actually to my 96 truck when I was putting it back together and installed a cam and roller valvetrain.

Finding #1 tdc is not super critical if you are doing it just to install the new springs and rockers......it was my understanding that bringing the cyl to the top on each piston was just to help you not lose a valve, at least thats how I did it, just looking through the plug hole and turning it over, until the cyl was at the top and thats just in CASE you let go of a valve so it doesnt drop too far to get. I didnt drop any.

beforelower.jpg
 




Turdle

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Another way
If the intake valve is starting to lift, the exhaust valve of the same cylinder is surely seated, and vice-versa. Just work your way around the engine slowly.

A remote starter switch comes in handy for this, but be careful to just bump it
 




JDraper

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You have the cylinder #'s correct for all standard Ford V-8 OHV motors. #1 is indeed the front passenger's side cylinder. If you have the valves closed on this cylinder with the damper at TDC, you are at the top of the compression stroke. If you happen to be off by 1 crankshaft revolution, the exhaust valve on # 1 will be full open. You've got the dots right too.
 




dreamr

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Thank you all for your support. I know I being a bit of mewbie here lol.

It's all new to me from this point forward so...........I'll have more newbie questions. ;)

I have to go pick up my daughter, then she gets to help me pull the heads though she doesn't know it yet. She'll be perfect for cleaning and labeling pushrods......

Ya know the sad part, I stopped by Brad's Custom auto today to pick up a couple odds and ends. Then they ask me if I want a motor.......306 500 miles with the same intake I am using Performer heads and the e-cam.........$1500.....GRRR I could have saved so much cash and had a fresh bottom end :fire:
I guess the car got run on the track twice and the guy bought a 351 stroked up a bit that they are now installing.
 




dreamr

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Alrighty then....the heads are finally off.....hehe time to start installing new stuff :D

It would have been a lot easier though if i would have disconnected the ground strap from the driver head before lifting the head off of the car. :rolleyes:

I was pleased to see why I love a ford pushrod engine. 170k and I can still see the factory crosshatch on all 6 of the cylinders I can see (the other 2 pistons are at top).... I was worried since I cannot afford to go into the bottom end yet. they are smooth as glass with no visible wear marks.. A bit dirty thanks to me forgetting about that ground strip, but thats what shop vacs are for right.

cylinder_wall_2.JPG

cylinder_wall.JPG


Now I do have another question. Most of the pistons look like the ones in the above. However #6 ( below) is very "glazed" looking. Why the difference, and what would cause this. I believe looking at the deck that I had a couple small headgasket leaks on the driver side....is that the cause?
Should I clean it up with some sandpaper?
nasty_pistons.JPG


All in all though look at all the cleaning I exposed for myself :rolleyes: I wonder how far I can clean down the tranny tunnel.......

And lastly should I clean out the lifter valley....ya know make it pretty and clean, or just make sure there are no particles and leave it with it's "coating"?

P.s. ignore the fram filter, I flushed the engine before I started this, and threw a cheap filter on after word to protect the bung......kinda crushed the filter though oops
bare_block.JPG


For the next couple days I am just cleaning and painting. Saturday should see the beginnings as I had to solicit help for the motor mount and oil pan gasket project.
 




dreamr

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Well I got impatient today. I ran out of stuff to paint with the timing cover so....I jumped in and changed the oil pan gasket and motor mounts. Realistically it was a very easy job though a bit time consuming.

Lifting the engine was quite easy after disconecting the tranny mount and the motor mounts. I placed a jack under a block of wood at the front of the bellhousing and lifted her up as high as I could. Then I ran a safety strap from my rafters to the block.

safety_strap.JPG


Then of course spent an hour cleaning and happily painting.

I was a bit daunted by the oil pan gasket as I have repeatedly been told that I would have to either drop the K-member or take the engine clear up....

....not true. it is actually quite easy to access in the car with the engine lifted a few inches and the motor mounts out of the way.

oil_pan_access.JPG


Hopefully this gasket will end my oil leak issues!!!!! It is a felpro steel core silicone coated gasket ......for 55 bucks it had better not leak:mad:

new_gasket.JPG
 




JDraper

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...Hopefully this gasket will end my oil leak issues!!!!! It is a felpro steel core silicone coated gasket ......for 55 bucks it had better not leak:mad:

Keeping the gaskets from leaking is all in the prepwork and torquing. You have to be sure that everything is clean, and that the flange on the pan is straight. If you pay attention to details on the front end of the project, you won't have to worry about crap later on.
 




dreamr

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Keeping the gaskets from leaking is all in the prepwork and torquing. You have to be sure that everything is clean, and that the flange on the pan is straight. If you pay attention to details on the front end of the project, you won't have to worry about crap later on.

Well it is as clean as I could get it......the surfaces are nice and smooth, but were a bit discolored yet. I think this car had many oil leaks for many years. It just doesn't alll come off.
 




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Rod bearings.
 








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IF I'm right your not pulling the engine out. With all that knew found horse power you will have those rod bearings with the worn surfaces may need to be changed. They wear more then the crank bearings due to way they rotate around the crank taking most of the load from the recipicating force of the rod/piston up and down force. You may be able to change them with the block still in car. Or might have to raise just a little. New rod bearings would also reduce the air space between bearing surface and crank journal due to normal wear. This could also raise oil pressure.
How many miles on that motor?
Just turn the snout of crank untill the piston is about the 6:00 clock position. Back off rod nuts to end of bolt. Then just take a wooden dowl or brass bar and gently tap end of bolt to raise piston enough to remove bottom bearing. Then place some 3/8" rubber hose over rod bolts so they do not scratch crank journal. Move piston up a little more to remove top halve of bearing. Sometimes a long wooden dowl can be placed up inside piston and tapped on to move piston up also. These bearings are only around $5 each. I think this would give you a better piece of mind about the bottom end. I know this contradicts your title, but what's more important. You sure do have plenty of $$$ tied up. This would be some added insurance, especially in the longevity of the engine. Remember there is going to be a lot more added thrust on those allready used bearings.
One other thing that you could do before buying rod bearings if you so chose is to use plastigage strips to check clearances. Just remove rod cap and place on top of bearing, retorque and use the scale that come with the plastigage to measure air space. Then see if it falls into specs. I would surely at least do this.
 




dreamr

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I was thinking about the oil pump while I had the pan dropped.....Unfortunately I could not access the bolts.....with that said I don't think I can access the bottom end with the engine in the car. I was able to raise it several inches, but was stoped when the tranny hit the top of the tunnel. Even with that much clearance I was not able to remove the oil pan completely, merely shift it to the sides to clean the rim.

I wish I could go in there and take a look at bearings and such. That is a great piece of advice....
Unfortunately I don't think I can. a rebuild is in the future as the car has 170k on it. My thoughts there are that the current project is setting the stage for the future. If I can get the top end set up how I wan't it and be relatively gentle with it. I can replace the long block with a stroker (331?) in about 2 years (9-11K miles).

My hope is that the bottom end will hold together til then to give me time to get the tranny and rear end out of the way as well.






So looks like I am going out to breakfast with the wife and wee one, but when I get back I would love any input on the bottom end plans you may have.

Also I need to put in yesterday's update.......cam install wasn't nearly as bad as I thought it would be.....
 


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410Fortune

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If you pulled the trans lines, trans mount, driveshafts, etc you could pull the entire drivetrain out of the car, but it requires a hoist :)
Mine was $75 floor model from a Checker.
After borrowing one about 3 times I finally added one to the collection.
But nice work so far, looks like its coming along very nicely
 




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