Bad or Burnt Exhaust smell in cabin during hard acceleration.

[F150EB]

This is a pretty informative site about the TSB :

http://vitalysmobileautodiagnostics.com/12573/exhaust-odor-in-the-vehicle-2011-2015-ford-explorer

Nice find, my vehicle is in the dealership for this TSB I assume as we speak. I'm told it will take 3 days for parts to arrive, I will update when I can with the results.

I don't understand how this issue is ongoing since 2011 and Ford hasn't figured out a way to implement this TSB before the vehicle leaves the factory or correct the problem outright. They must have done some ridiculous cost analysis of the time it would take to do this on every explorer vs the probably small percentage that will be brought in for this issue later on, except they left out of their analysis how upset the customer will be when their new car smells like ****, and how much that will cost them in the long run.

 

[gypsy321]

Nice find, my vehicle is in the dealership for this TSB I assume as we speak. I'm told it will take 3 days for parts to arrive, I will update when I can with the results.

I don't understand how this issue is ongoing since 2011 and Ford hasn't figured out a way to implement this TSB before the vehicle leaves the factory or correct the problem outright. They must have done some ridiculous cost analysis of the time it would take to do this on every explorer vs the probably small percentage that will be brought in for this issue later on, except they left out of their analysis how upset the customer will be when their new car smells like ****, and how much that will cost them in the long run.

Ford won't get serious about this issue until they get dragged thru the mud like Toyota and GM have been recently.Hopefully the class action lawsuit taking place in Florida will get this on the news and bring the message home to all those Explorer drivers who simply put up with being poisoned.

 

[User.pb1]

6-2-15 update re exhaust smell inside cabin

I have been able to verify that the exhaust is actually coming into my vehicle through the a.c. vents. It is especially strong through the rear vents when the rear a.c. is on.

My Ford Dealer has tried to repair the problem three times and the last time they put in writing that there was a problem, but they were unable to correct it.

My Explorer now has 15,000 miles on it, and the inside of my nose burns inside every time I drive it due to exhaust coming into the vehicle. I am forced to leave the rear a.c. off completely and drive with my windows down. I live in Florida so it's not pleasant.

I can not believe that FORD is ignoring this issue and continuing to put these vehicles into the hands of consumers. I can not imagine what exposure to the toxic exhaust fumes could do to an infant that this in the back of this vehicle.

I'm starting the Lemon Law Process.

This will be my last FORD.

 

[blwnsmoke]

No one has one yet. They just started production this month.

Peter

They are out there because Ford reported sales of them for May on their monthly sales figures.

 

[blwnsmoke]

I hear what your saying but it doesn't matter how much I like the car, nothing is worth a safety risk to my family. I would take a KIA any day over this explorer if the KIA didn't expose my family to toxic exhaust fumes. Nothing against KIA by the way.

Also I buy my cars and keep them for years. I want a reliable long lasting vehicle that is low maintenance. I don't like car payments and I don't particularly like the car buying process. This explorer was supposed to last my family a long time.

I appreciate your response so please don't take this the wrong way but, if your 2011 was so excellent, why did you get rid of it?

Although I am sure the smell is very bothersome to you an very unpleasant, I think you are blowing the "exposing my family to toxic exhaust fumes" out of proportion. You realize that anytime you have the vents on in traffic you have exhaust fumes entering your cabin, correct? I smell car exhaust every day (not from my vehicle but from vehicles in front of me).

Also, the government says that essentially you should keep your exposure to below 70ppm. The fact that your detector isn't registering 30ppm shows that although you smell an odor, there are no unsafe levels entering your vehicle.

In fact, as I've been following this thread for the years that it has been going on, I do not recall a single person who has had a detector report unsafe levels. So it is more about preventing the "odor" from entering the vehicle as easily as it does then preventing "toxic exhaust fumes" from entering the vehicle.

 

[peterk9]

They are out there because Ford reported sales of them for May on their monthly sales figures.

I wonder if those 'sales figures' represented the orders that were placed by customers through the various dealers? Production only started on May 4th. I have been following the Order Status threads and there they say the 2016's have just begun arriving at dealer lots.

Peter

 

[blwnsmoke]

I wonder if those 'sales figures' represented the orders that were placed by customers through the various dealers? Production only started on May 4th. I have been following the Order Status threads and there they say the 2016's have just begun arriving at dealer lots.

Peter

Could have been just the last few days. They can't count it as a sale unless it has been sold in Ford's system. A deposit on a vehicle does not count as a sale. Once "sold" the warranty starts from that date.

Here is a quote from Ford's sales info:

"The 2016 Explorer went on sale in May, and retail sales increased 24 percent. Explorer is America’s best-selling mid-size utility with its best May retail sales results since 2004."

https://media.ford.com/content/dam/fordmedia/North America/US/2015/06/02/may2015sales.pdf

So although I guess it is really vague, I take that as they sold some. Could be wrong since they don't break down 15 vs 16 MY sales. Then again, being "on sale" rather then saying "sold" is two totally different things.

 

[JE]

Although I am sure the smell is very bothersome to you an very unpleasant, I think you are blowing the "exposing my family to toxic exhaust fumes" out of proportion. You realize that anytime you have the vents on in traffic you have exhaust fumes entering your cabin, correct? I smell car exhaust every day (not from my vehicle but from vehicles in front of me).

Also, the government says that essentially you should keep your exposure to below 70ppm. The fact that your detector isn't registering 30ppm shows that although you smell an odor, there are no unsafe levels entering your vehicle.

In fact, as I've been following this thread for the years that it has been going on, I do not recall a single person who has had a detector report unsafe levels. So it is more about preventing the "odor" from entering the vehicle as easily as it does then preventing "toxic exhaust fumes" from entering the vehicle.

I agree with blwnsmoke. Voice of reason.

I know there are labs which will analyze water quality with remarkable accuracy for a nominal fee (less than $100) and tell you everything that's in it. I wonder if anyone does the same for air quality? Other than that we're just guessing.

 

[LukerDooker]

IMO when you really smell it in the car its way too much.:thumbdwn:

When the vents are open and a diesel truck gives off a blast in front or is upwind, its pretty bad in the Ex-the Ex has fans always active if Climate is even turned on - it can suck fumes right into the cabin pronto.

 

[nixhex]

Although I am sure the smell is very bothersome to you an very unpleasant, I think you are blowing the "exposing my family to toxic exhaust fumes" out of proportion. You realize that anytime you have the vents on in traffic you have exhaust fumes entering your cabin, correct? I smell car exhaust every day (not from my vehicle but from vehicles in front of me).

Also, the government says that essentially you should keep your exposure to below 70ppm. The fact that your detector isn't registering 30ppm shows that although you smell an odor, there are no unsafe levels entering your vehicle.

In fact, as I've been following this thread for the years that it has been going on, I do not recall a single person who has had a detector report unsafe levels. So it is more about preventing the "odor" from entering the vehicle as easily as it does then preventing "toxic exhaust fumes" from entering the vehicle.

You can feel free to take your chances all you want, but the fact of the matter is that exhaust gases are getting the vehicle and venting through the AC system. Regardless of high level of CO, exhaust gases are a known health risk:

http://www.ehhi.org/reports/exhaust/summary.shtml

I normally run my AC on re-circulation mode, so I don't make a habit of breathing in exhaust fumes from traffic. This is a bit different I would say. Exhaust from the tailpipes is being pumped right back into the car through the AC system. I am not making this up, my Ford dealer has acknowledged this.

But feel free to put your family through this, that's your choice. I don't think I am over reacting at all since this has been going on for 5 years or so and is something that is totally unacceptable to have to deal with on a brand new 40k plus car. I am done with Ford. I decided to give them a chance and they have cost my family stress and hassle dealing with this issue. You can say its stupid or sensitive all you want.

I didn't look up your history so I don't know what you have posted before but to tell you the truth, I wouldn't even be surprised if Ford had people like yourself on here under false user names trying to calm people down as not to make more trouble for themselves. We know they are monitoring this thread. In this case its a bit ironic that your user name is blownsmoke! HAHAH

With all the trouble this has caused me Ford will never get my families business again. I will also spread the word to anyone I know.

 

[nixhex]

On another note, the car is going back for round 3 tomorrow morning and I hope to start the lemon law process soon. They said that a vent was not properly hooked up from the first TSB and acknowledged that the exhaust was venting through the AC system. Long story short, I picked it up and the smell was some what reduced but still there.

My local Ford dealer has been understanding so far and mostly pleasant to work with, but that doesn't change the fact that from what I have read they will probably never be able to fix this car properly as there is a major design flaw in it.

It would be interesting to know if other companies have designed a rear venting system like this so close to the exhaust in their SUVs. I would assume this isn't a 100% new design for Ford and they might have adapted it from previous generations of vehicles. Who knows.

 

[nixhex]

I agree with blwnsmoke. Voice of reason.

I know there are labs which will analyze water quality with remarkable accuracy for a nominal fee (less than $100) and tell you everything that's in it. I wonder if anyone does the same for air quality? Other than that we're just guessing.

I asked Ford if there was anything they could do to test the air quality of the car to assure me 100% that there were not dangerous gases getting into the car even when I don't smell the burning smell. They basically just ignored the question and never gave me an answer. There was so much going on at the time and once they found the vent unhooked they assumed it was fixed. They even sent the same mechanic who rode with me the first time out to test drive it again and he was not 100% sure it was gone. I will ask again tomorrow. At this point even if the TSB did fix the burning smell at high rpms I could never really trust the car again.

So yes I have given up hope of fixing this problem and just want a new car at this point. I wish there was an easier way of dealing with this and I could just get a refund. That's the only way Ford could make me somewhat happy again. I can never get back all of the time and hassle I have spent on this issue. I would still never buy a Ford again, but would be satisfied that they did the right thing.

 

[blwnsmoke]

You can feel free to take your chances all you want, but the fact of the matter is that exhaust gases are getting the vehicle and venting through the AC system. Regardless of high level of CO, exhaust gases are a known health risk:

http://www.ehhi.org/reports/exhaust/summary.shtml

I normally run my AC on re-circulation mode, so I don't make a habit of breathing in exhaust fumes from traffic. This is a bit different I would say. Basically the exhaust from the tailpipes is being pumped right back into the car through the AC system. That's worth repeating. The exhaust gases are being sucked in through a rear vent in the car that circulates through the cabin air system! I am not making this up, my Ford dealer has acknowledged this.

But feel free to put your family through this, that's your choice. I don't think I am over reacting at all since this has been going on for 5 years or so and is something that is totally unacceptable to have to deal with on a brand new 40k plus car. I am done with Ford. I decided to give them a chance and they have cost my family stress and hassle dealing with this issue. You can say its stupid or sensitive all you want.

I didn't look up your history so I don't know what you have posted before but to tell you the truth, I wouldn't even be surprised if Ford had people like yourself on here under false user names trying to calm people down as not to make more trouble for themselves. We know they are monitoring this thread. In this case its a bit ironic that your user name is blownsmoke! HAHAH

With all the trouble this has caused me Ford will never get my families business again. I will also spread the word to anyone I know.

blwnsmoke = owned a 2005 diesel (blows black smoke), a 2007 diesel and a 2015 diesel.

As far as me being an undercover Ford rep.. give me a break.. almost 1,600 posts and been a member here for over 4 years.. ya ok.

Not once did I say it was stupid or sensitive. And yes, regardless of whether you have the vehicle on recirculate or not, you will still get exhaust fumes from other vehicles in the car. The Explorer like any other vehicle is not 100% sealed shut, outside air enters the vehicle at all times.

 

[peterk9]

.....I didn't look up your history so I don't know what you have posted before but to tell you the truth, I wouldn't even be surprised if Ford had people like yourself on here under false user names trying to calm people down as not to make more trouble for themselves. We know they are monitoring this thread. In this case its a bit ironic that your user name is blownsmoke! HAHAH

With all the trouble this has caused me Ford will never get my families business again. I will also spread the word to anyone I know.

The only Ford people who look at these threads are the 2 Ford reps who are here to try and help us. Neither of them report back to anyone at Ford. They are a go between the customer (us) and the Regional Customer Service Managers.
In no way is blwnsmoke associated with Ford. We both became members here around the same time.

Peter

 

[Bvancour1124]

I had a 2014 Ford Explorer limited bought brand new, put 19,000 miles on it and had the smell issue the whole time. I took it in to several different dealerships several times and no one could find a fix. They did a TSB on it but still didn't help at all. I ended up going back to the dealership I bought it from, they gave me the amount I owed on it and I bought a 2015 new Ford Explorer limited. I have had it 5 days and it too is doing the same exact thing. When you accelerate at least 3,000-3,500 RPM and get up to 55-60+ mph wait about 5-10 seconds and you get the strong exhaust fumes smell in the vehicle. I'm so fed up with ford. I have a $44,000 vehicle (twice now) and they can't find a fix?!?! It is so aggravating. When I had my 2014 explorer I started a regional case with ford but they could never find a fix or get the case taken any further. Ready to stop buying fords, and we've been a ford family my whole life.

 

[nixhex]

I talked to the Ford mechanic this morning. So I will be the first to admit I was a bit wrong with the "venting" understanding. I updated my previous post accordingly.

I understood this to mean there was a vent that connected to the AC system somewhere in the rear bumper and they forgot to hook it up. It was actually a tiny black piece of rubber that you can see on the bottom right and left side of the tailgate when its open. These are actually vents and one was missing on my car. Go figure. He explained to me that there were "vents" all over the car to let air vent for things like shutting the door and they were not connected to the AC at all. More for pressure. The smell could still be pulled in through the AC system however. But it's not like hooking a hose on your tail pipe straight to your face as someone may picture in the worst case scenario.

He just had another 2014 in a day or two ago with the same issue. He told me they had no way to do an air quality test. He couldn't say one way or the other if I we could ever be 100% sure the exhaust was not continuing to get in the cabin, even without smelling it. He said there is an obvious design flaw and something was not caught in R+D during the development of this model explorer. He did say the venting system on it wasn't really that much different than any other SUV or hatchback that Ford makes.

In his opinion if the rear mufflers were an inch or so longer it might not have this problem. But he stressed it was designed this way for some reason.

So the next steps are to contact Ford and see what they suggest. This is round 3 so lemon law here I come. They did mention that they will usually try to do something with the customer before it gets that far, so we will see. The only option they could give me would be a refund. I am not switching into another Explorer or Ford.

 

[nixhex]

The only Ford people who look at these threads are the 2 Ford reps who are here to try and help us. Neither of them report back to anyone at Ford. They are a go between the customer (us) and the Regional Customer Service Managers.
In no way is blwnsmoke associated with Ford. We both became members here around the same time.

Peter

Yeah I was trying to be a bit sarcastic with blwnsmoke about that. It seems it came off wrong.

You seem like you have more info on this than me, but I have a hard time believing the Ford reps on here do not report back to anyone. If they are on here representing Ford, addressing concerns and directing people to Ford customer service, they are getting paid to do it. So someone has obviously approved them to spend working hours monitoring this thread and responding appropriately.

 

[nixhex]

And yes, regardless of whether you have the vehicle on recirculate or not, you will still get exhaust fumes from other vehicles in the car. The Explorer like any other vehicle is not 100% sealed shut, outside air enters the vehicle at all times.

The mechanic this morning stressed keeping it on recirculate to not breathe in other cars exhaust day to day. While I agree it's not 100% sealed you have to admit that recirculate pulls in a minimum amount of outside air vs fresh air mode. The outside air and exhaust fumes you breathe in is significantly different. Open up the vents and you can smell all kinds of things vs when its closed.

But maybe you don't agree. In any case I will only post new things related to updates and information from service from now on. I am not going to waste any more time defending the need to breathe clean air in my car.

 

[wdeadwyler]

I talked to the Ford mechanic this morning. So I will be the first to admit I was a bit wrong with the "venting" understanding.

I understood this to mean there was a vent that connected to the AC system somewhere in the rear bumper and they forgot to hook it up. It was actually a tiny black piece of rubber that you can see on the bottom right and left side of the tailgate when its open. These are actually vents and one was missing on my car. Go figure. He explained to me that there were "vents" all over the car to let air vent for things like shutting the door and they were not connected to the AC at all. More for pressure. The smell could still be pulled in through the AC system however. But it's not like hooking a hose on your tail pipe straight to your face as someone may picture in the worst case scenario.

He just had another 2014 in a day or two ago with the same issue. He told me they had no way to do an air quality test. He couldn't say one way or the other if I we could ever be 100% sure the exhaust was not continuing to get in the cabin, even without smelling it. He said there is an obvious design flaw and something was not caught in R+D during the development of this model explorer. He did say the venting system on it wasn't really that much different than any other SUV or hatchback that Ford makes.

In his opinion if the rear mufflers were an inch or so longer it might not have this problem. But he stressed it was designed this way for some reason.

So the next steps are to contact Ford and see what they suggest. This is round 3 so lemon law here I come. They did mention that they will usually try to do something with the customer before it gets that far, so we will see. The only option they could give me would be a refund. I am not switching into another Explorer or Ford.

They fixed that in mine too only to have it not fix the problem, extending the exhaust looked ridiculous! They can't fix the problem as it is the cat and they don't have a new one yet to replace so you will be stuck with the problem. I went to Ford HQ and found the right person and didn't have to get an attorney and they did the right thing. I no longer own a ford. I would not take mine back from service until the smell was gone and it ended up in service for 45 days and that was longer than my states lemon law policy. They can't fix it, they will try everything, and it doesn't work.

 

[JE]

In his opinion if the rear mufflers were an inch or so longer it might not have this problem. But he stressed it was designed this way for some reason.

Now that's something new... Anyone with "the smell" willing to wrap a couple tin cans around their tips to extend them an inch or two? At least we might learn something.